Yes you can be required to take a PT test while on profile. For it to be a valid test, you must perform one of the aerobic events: run, bike, swim, or walk. If you take an alternate aerobic event you must be given at least 90 days to practice that event. If you believe that this action is endangering your health I recommend you have a face to face meeting with your 1SG and CDR. You need to prepare for this meeting by putting together your facts and concerns. You must ensure that your discussion with the command team is professional and unemotional.
You should also provide a recommended solution such a time when you believe you will be fit enough to take a PT test. You can also discuss the issue with your medical provider and he may increase your profile in a manner that prohibits a PT Test. Keep in mind that the Commander can override the doctor’s profile but he will assume responsibility for your welfare by doing so.
I suggest you read: AR 350-1 and AR 40-501 Chapter 7
Para 1-24d(2):
Personnel will be excused from physical fitness training only during periods of temporary or permanent medical limitations established in accordance with AR 40–501.
Para 1-24df(4):
Personnel who cannot take part in physical fitness training because of a profile condition will be placed in rehabilitative programs and, within profile guidelines given by health care personnel, be supervised by the commander.
Para 1-24e:
The APFT consists of pushups, situps, and a 2-mile run, done in that order on the same day. To be considered a record test, these events must be completed within two hours from the start of the pushup event until completion of the 2-mile run or alternate aerobic event. (See repetition and time guidelines in FM 21–20.) Record APFT scores will be annotated on a DA Form 705 (Army Physical Fitness Test Scorecard). For Soldiers on a permanent profile or an extended temporary profile (more than three months), a record test must include an aerobic event. The only approved aerobic events are the 2-mile run, 800-yard swim, 6.2-mile bike ride (stationary or track), or the 2.5-mile walk. Soldiers on permanent profile or a temporary profile of long duration (more than three months) will receive point scores for only those events taken. For example, if a Soldier has a permanent profile for the 2-mile run event and score 70 points in the pushup, 85 points in the situp and receives a “GO” for the 2.5 mile Walk, he will receive a score of 155 points in the total score column of the DA Form 705
Para 1-24,e(4)
Personnel with permanent medical profiles that preclude participation in the pushup or situp event will take the remaining events if a physician or physician’s assistant approves. The 2-mile run event, or an approved alternate test event as outlined in FM 21–20, must be taken if the test is for record. The alternate test is for Soldiers with permanent physical profiles that prevent them from running 2 miles. Soldiers with temporary profiles of long duration (more than 3 months) may also take an alternate test if approved by the commander and health care personnel. Soldiers must be given 3 months to prepare for the alternate test from either the date of the profile or the date recommended by health care personnel.
In closing please keep in mind most leaders want to do what is right for the Soldier and Unit. Therefore it is important to try to understand what your leadership is trying to achieve, why are they trying to achieve it, and what is the best way you can assist in resolving the issue at hand. I have never met a leader who would intentionally hurt one of their Soldiers. Sometimes it may feel like a leader is focusing on you but usually from the leader’s perspective they are just trying to make you a better Soldier.
The question is are their methods correct? This is where you need to be professional and discuss the issue with them from a knowledgeable position and present a reasonable solution. If you do not feel you are getting a fair shake after speaking to the CO Command Team then request to see the BNCSM/BNCDR on open door policy.
Comments
PFC Jones
Can a NCO break a profile for a soldier?
I have a partial tear on my R ACL. The only thing I’m allowed to do is wear boots wear my uniform. I had already set up an appointment for physical therapy and surgery, but now they’re making me go out to a field problem. Regardless of the profile. Who do I talk to about this? What reg can I use as a reference? I understand it won’t look good for me, but I wanted to take care of myself so I won’t have these problems in the future.
Eck
You can still go to the field as long as they are mindful of your profile. If you are made to violate your profile, then the NCOs and ultimately, your commander, put themselves as risk should you injure yourself further.
You can speak to your PA and also take your case to the IG. As a young Soldier, I was made to go to the field while on profile. I was put in the operations tent and performed duties whithin the limits of my profile.
PFC Jones
Even if it says no k pop, or body armor? I messed up my knee even more though. Everyone kept telling me a profile is a recommendation. That its not a restriction. I just want to know where I stand. I’ve heard so many different things and I’ve looked up the regs. I’ve yet to find anything covering the temporary profiles. Sorry if it looks as if I’m complaining. I’m really annoyed at the state of my condition and I just want answers.
Mark Gerecht
Profiles are recommendation to the commander. Only the commander can make that decision and then he/she assumes responsibility for your welfare should you be injured in a manner that would not have happened had the profile of the doctor been followed. You can work profile issues with your chain of command, the doctor, the Patient Affairs Rep at the hospital, IG, and JAG
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PFC martinez
Here is my situation a couple months back I fractured my wrist I went on profile saying no push up but I have been flaged for a previous pt failure.. my profile has been extended and my chain wants to give me a recorded test I have a permanent profile for my knee so I can only do the walk and sit ups how will they score me on push ups if I have a profile saying I cant do them?
Mark Gerecht
The Answer to your question can be found in AR 350-1 para 124e. There is a portion that talks about scoring of individuals on profile. Basically you will be given a “Go” in that event. You must also be provided 90 days to practice the alternate event and twice the length of your profile to recover. You can also check FM 7-22 for additional information.
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Dave
“If you take an alternate aerobic event you must be given at least 90 days to practice that event”
Can you refernce this statement?
Mark Gerecht
Dave,
The answer to your question can be found on the following ASKTOP.net Post How long do I have to prepare for an alternate event?
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Mark Gerecht
You can find the answer to this question in the following ASKTOP.net post How long do I have to practice for an Alternate Event for the APFT?
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Marcus
I have a no PT profile for a week due to a large cyst on my abdomen that needed to be lanced. The wound is fresh and I’m on some heavy meds but my unit insists on me doing PT. It says no PT for a week…but here they are making up alternate workouts for me. It hurts just leaning forward. With this happening to me and others I am NOT under the impression that they care for soldiers…they just need their numbers up.
Mark Gerecht
If you have a no PT profile, your commander can override the medical doctor. However he assumes any and all risks associated with an injury or issue associated with your health that is directly related to a violation of your profile. Look at it this way. If you have a no PT profile and are found to be playing basketball the command could punish you under an Article 15 proceeding. Only you can determine the severity of the issue you are describing. If you believe you are in danger of hurting yourself then you should consider requesting a meeting with your 1SG and Company Commander. Regulations that cover this issue include: AR 350-1, AR 40-501, FM 7-22. The best way to approach the chain of command is from a factual and professional perspective. You must leave your emotions at the door. Consider providing some alternative solutions to your chain of command. If you believe the chain of command is not listing to you there are other options available. They include seeking assistance from your Battalion Chain of Command, the IG, and or JAG. Depending on the severity of the matter you could consider filing an Article 138 complaint against your commander. Here is a link to the article on Article 138. What is an Article 138?
Hope this helps
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julio gonsalves
I was discharged in ’88 chapter 13 for failing a pt test (run) even though on profile under dr care and still and pending possible surgery on my ankle (class 3 sprain with 85% of ankle ligaments torn) i am now in the process of filling disability claim with va, was that supposed to happen? i ask because my Quite a few of my buddies keep telling me i should have contested this years ago.
Hunter
I was flagged awhile back for failing my run. I have been on a temp profile on and off for 10 months now. I have been in the Army 3 1/2 years and im still a PFC b/c of a resperatory illness that doesn’t help my run at all (which is why ive failed it). I am now on a permanent profile stating I can’t take an APFT at all. No Walk or anything. Is there a regulation stating that I can have my flag lifted and get promoted seeing as how I will never be able to take an APFT
don
A Soldier has a permanent profile No Running. The alternate apft events checked include walking/swimming/biking. A recent achilles issue rules out walking for now and the Occ Therapist recommends biking. No paperwork was signed nor has the perm profile been ammended. Does the Soldier choose the alternate event or does the command?
Mark Gerecht
Don,
Great question. Typically, generally, usually the command will determine the alternate event. The doctor can make his recommendation but ultimately it is the Commander’s call. Let look at the situation you described. The Soldier should have a temporary profile that authorizes the biking event. The doctor can also make a comment to clarify the requirement. For example: Soldier may only be administered the bike event as an alternate aerobic event for APFT testing. A recent Achilles injury prevents the Soldier from safely participating in the Swim or walk events. This simple statement makes it clear to the Commander that the doctor believes taking other alternate events could cause additional harm or injury to the Soldier. If the Commander chooses to ignore the doctor’s recommendation then the Commander could be held liable if the Soldier is injured while performing an exercise not approved by the doctor. The Commander is provided the latitude to make the final determination because they are typically in the best position to select the alternate event resources available to his unit. If the doctor states the Soldier must swim and the specified swimming area is not accessible to the Soldier then the command cannot support the doctors request and will need to seek an alternative option. It is also important that command allows the Soldier the mandatory 90 days to prepare for the alternate event. The 90 days starts on the date the profile was issued. For additional information on Alternate Events and APFT related information see AR 350-1 paragraph 1-24(e) and FM 7-22
Hope this helps!
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Spc Farnham
Ok heres my question im going through the meb process i have recieved my unfit for duty memo and waiting on my rateings i have a perminate profile for lower body can my ncoic make me do a apft